Why Southeast Greenland's glaciers have slown down since 2005

By: Dr. Jeff Masters , 3:57 PM GMT on December 15, 2009

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I'm in San Francisco for the annual meeting of the American Geophysical Union, the world's largest gathering of climate scientists. I saw ten or so great talks yesterday (and five really boring ones!) Here's a summary of the the most interesting talk I heard yesterday:

If you plan on owning ocean front property after the year 2050, you should pay close attention to the glaciers In Greenland. Greenland holds enough ice to raise global sea level by over 20 feet (6.5 meters), should its ice cap completely disintegrate--though such an event would likely take centuries to occur. Still, should the climate warm 2°C or more this century, partial melting of the Greenland Ice Sheet could readily raise global sea level by a meter or more by 2100. That's why scientists reacted with concern during 2003 - 2005, when all of the glaciers in southeastern Greenland accelerated in synchrony to speeds 30% to 210% faster than they had flowed in 1996. As they sped up, the glaciers began dumping huge amounts of ice into the ocean off the coast of southeast Greenland, more than doubling Greenland's contribution to global sea rise, to .57 mm/year. Would the glaciers keep accelerating, bringing about an increasing disintegration of the Greenland Ice Sheet? Nobody knew, since computer models of glacial dynamics were (and still are) in a primitive state.


Figure 1. Helheim Glacier in southeast Greenland, in three images captured in 2004, 2005, and 2006. The glacier accelerated significantly in 2005, and the face of the glacier retreated 5 km inland (middle frame) compared to 2004. However, by the summer of 2006, the acceleration ceased, the the glacier returned back to its 2004 position. Image credit: Ian Howat, University of Washington.

Well, it turned out that 2005 was the peak of the glacial acceleration event. The glaciers in southeast Greenland have returned to where they were eight or nine years ago--still causing a net loss of mass that is raising global sea level, but not as fast as in 2003 - 2005. In a talk titled, "Ocean regulation of glacier dynamics in south-east Greenland and implication for ice sheet mass changes", Tavi Murray and colleagues from the UK's Swansea University presented a plausible theory for why this strange synchronous speed-up and slow-down occurred. Using satellite, aircraft, and surface observations, the researchers found that air temperatures in the region did not vary much over 2003 - 2005 (Figure 2). Thus, a major increase in temperature could be ruled out as the cause of the glacier surge. However, study of the ocean temperatures near the coast revealed strong clues that ocean currents were responsible for the surge.

Figure 2. Ocean currents off the east coast of Greenland feature the cold East Greenland Coastal Current flowing north to south (white arrows) and the warm Irminger Current flowing south to north (red arrows). Image credit: Arctic Climate Impact Assessment.

Ordinarily, the southeast coast of Greenland features a cold water current flowing north to south, called the East Greenland Coastal Current (EGCC). Much of the cold water for this current is supplied by melting of the 14 glaciers in southeast Greenland that empty into the sea (two of these glaciers, Kangerdlugssuaq and Helheim, represent 35% of east Greenland's total glacial discharge). A few hundred kilometers offshore, a warm water current called the Irminger Current flows the opposite direction, bringing warm water from the North Atlantic northward. In 2003, it happened that weather conditions over Greenland brought an unusually low amount of run-off of precipitation. With little new mass pushing the glaciers seaward, the glaciers responded by greatly reducing the amount of ice they dumped into the ocean by the shore. As a result, the East Greenland Coastal Current slowed down and warmed, which allowed the warm Irminger Current to advance towards the coast, warming the coastal waters even more. All that warm water near the coast began melting the glaciers where they reached the sea, causing the glaciers all along the southeast coast of Greenland to accelerate and rapidly thin between 2003 - 2005. By 2006, the thinning glaciers had dumped so much new ice into the ocean near the coast that the waters cooled and the East Greenland Coastal Current re-established itself. This cooled the glaciers at their marine termination points and slowed down the glacial surge, putting the glaciers back where they had been before 2003. This is a classic example of a negative feedback process--a change in weather conditions which generates a response, but the response creates conditions that tend to dampen the response.


Figure 3. Average temperatures for the only station in southeast Greenland with a century-long temperature record, Angmagssalik (called Ammassalik on the map in Figure 2). Temperatures in southeast Greenland during the 1930s and 1940s were similar to today's temperatures, suggesting that glacial surges like we witnessed in 2005 may have also occurred in the 1930s and 1940s, before we had monitoring capability. Image credit: NASA Goddard.

Commentary
As I commented in my previous post, Arctic sea ice loss appears to have created a new atmospheric circulation pattern that brings more warm air in the Arctic, creating a positive feedback loop that causes even more sea ice loss. This positive feedback loop was a bad news surprise that our climate models did not predict. Now we have evidence of a good news surprise that no model predicted--a negative feedback loop that acts to keep the southeast portion of Greenland's Ice Sheet from runaway glacial acceleration. We can expect many more surprises--good and bad--over the coming decades, as our climate responds to the huge shove human activities are giving it.

Ricky Rood in Copenhagen
Our Climate Change expert, Dr. Ricky Rood, is in Copenhagen for the COP15 climate change treaty negotiations. His latest post, called Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? makes for very interesting reading on how the U.S. is "wasting its intellect and time on disruptions designed to play to people at home".

Next post
I'll have another post from the AGU meeting Thursday or Friday this week.

Jeff Masters

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Quoting hurricanejunky:


Nobody is saying he's off limits but the Al Gore bashing gets old after a while. We're entitled to an opinion as are you. Why am I an ideologue because I think obsessive hatred and criticism of one person who doesn't really deserve it is wrong? I'm not trying to censor you I'm just pointing out that the behavior seems immature and unfounded.


Big Al (aka man-bear-pig of Southpark fame) is the object of derision & contempt because of his hubris & blatant "Do as I say, not as I do" (& make me & my cronies billions of $$$ while doing it) actions. His consumption of resources to heat/cool/light his multiple gi-normous residences, his private jetting around to "educate" & "speak" (hmmm teleconference or video symposium maybe?), his involvement with TN mining interests, his lack of credentials beyond the oratorical (which are not on a par with his pappy's FTR) - all directly contradict his "message" (delivered as fact or engraved on gold plate). And yes, that mushroom cloud in the trailer of his video info-commercial for "green products" is blatant fear mongering & contradictory to his "message" as nuclear power is viewed by many environmentalists as a viable solution to energy demand (though not if managed in slovenly Soviet-style - a la Chernobyl or Three Mile Island ).

Al Gore Under Fire For Huge Energy Consumption at Tennessee Home

WHOOPS - Energy Guzzled by Al Gore’s Home in Past Year Could Power 232 U.S. Homes for a Month

Just for fun - What is Al Gore's Carbon Footprint?

Al Gore, the world's first carbon billionaire?

Now to be clear, the derision has nothing to do with capitalism - autonomously making one's way to great wealth is a wonderful opportunity afforded to US citizens & those who go for it are to be lauded; unless they amass their wealth not by provided desired goods or services but instead hawking restrictive legislation & taxation that wrests income from citizens involuntarily while lining their own pockets (carbon offsets, yeeesh). All the while rolling in unfettered consumption of resources which they blather about needing to conserve. Therein lies the rub.
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Quoting hurricanejunky:


Doing great! The holidays are one of my favorite times of the year. The GW discussion gets old as it usually boils down to irresistible force meets immovable object, no one wins. Reminds me of playing tic-tac-toe with myself. Thanks for the compliment! How's the weather in your neck of the woods? We're 75 with HIGH humidity. Alot of foggy mornings lately.


Well, I am back in Ft. Lauderdale. They decided to give me a little break. Our weather is perfect. About 85 but low humidity. Light scattering of clouds and blue sky. Perfect. The beach is at the end of my street, so I may take a stroll down there and watch the Canadians and Germans pour Coppertan on themselves. We have been having an exceptionally warm season so far. Almost as if the globe is warming is true.
Member Since: July 17, 2009 Posts: 71 Comments: 26505
Quoting hurricanejunky:


Sweet! Nice holiday weather for sure. Still snowing?


nope :( haha supposed to snow friday through saturday, then cool down some more next week with intermittent snow chances
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
Quoting tornadodude:


oh wow, still warm out :P it is a toasty 15 here LOL


Sweet! Nice holiday weather for sure. Still snowing?
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
P451! If the state of Louisiana could talk, we would here it scream, "NO MORE RAIN, scoot, go, move, leave, adios, go hit Florida, go play in traffic in CA"!
Member Since: August 25, 2009 Posts: 20 Comments: 6785
Quoting hurricanejunky:


Nice but still warm. It's fun to have the cold hit around the holidays but the last few years haven't been too cool around Christmas. Right now:

75 degrees F / mostly cloudy
83% humidity
Pressure: 30.13
Wind from ENE at 6mph
UV index 2 Low
Visibility 10 mi.
Dewpoint: 70 degrees F




oh wow, still warm out :P it is a toasty 15 here LOL
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
Quoting IKE:


How is Flood? Anyone heard from him or his wife?


He was on yesterday if you go back thru the posts you can hear how he is progressing. Sounds like he's getting better by the day and getting around well with much less pain. That is GREAT news.
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Quoting atmoaggie:

I am pretty sure Bill Clinton invented the volcano, so no, Gore probably didn't cause this. Unless, maybe, Bill told him how to make them erupt...


See, I got you to defend Al Gore!!! I am framing this entry. LOL How are you doing atmoaggie? Been busy as you know. See many are still hoping for a White Christmas. Hope everyone gets their wishes this year.
Member Since: July 17, 2009 Posts: 71 Comments: 26505
Quoting IKE:


Good morning....

54.0 degrees and sunny....inland Florida panhandle...brisk winds....


Nice...maybe you'll see snow for Christmas?
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754. IKE
Quoting tornadodude:


Yeah, guess we will never know ;) Flood might know haha


How is Flood? Anyone heard from him or his wife?
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting tornadodude:


yeah Lol how's your weather?


Nice but still warm. It's fun to have the cold hit around the holidays but the last few years haven't been too cool around Christmas. Right now:

75 degrees F / mostly cloudy
83% humidity
Pressure: 30.13
Wind from ENE at 6mph
UV index 2 Low
Visibility 10 mi.
Dewpoint: 70 degrees F


Member Since: Posts: Comments:
752. IKE
Quoting AwakeInMaryland:
Back to the weather for a flash...forgive me....

Ike, is there a reason your post is directly after mine?? I just got here and you're dissin' me already? I'm just on my second cup of coffee...wait until I really get going, lol!

Good morning, btw! Always good to have someone bring us back down to earth!


Go


LOL...nah...it just worked out that way.

Quoting tornadofan:


Ike - wow, you might have some rain. How unusual.


Like we need anymore....rather impressive system.

Pattern may change after this low moves on out. Back to colder weather for awhile.
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting atmoaggie:

Actually, if it was dry/fluffy 10 to 1 ratio snow, that would be closer to 18 inches (if I am reading that correctly).


That would be very scary!! DFW, TX literally shuts down when 1 inch of sleet falls! This most likely will be a wet, heavy snow, about 12 inches of it! IF this happens, we'll make CNN, AP, USA Today!!!
Member Since: August 25, 2009 Posts: 20 Comments: 6785
Quoting Grothar:


All I know is that the night they supposedly landed on the moon, I was there with my telescope and didn't see anybody walking on the moon. And I heard that Universal Studios in California had cancelled all their tours that week!!!!! Wonder what they were filming that they didn't want anyone to see.


Yeah, guess we will never know ;) Flood might know haha
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
Back to the weather for a flash...forgive me....

Ike, is there a reason your post is directly after mine?? I just got here and you're dissin' me already? I'm just on my second cup of coffee...wait until I really get going, lol!

Good morning, btw! Always good to have someone bring us back down to earth!


Go
Member Since: August 19, 2008 Posts: 32 Comments: 1918
Quoting Grothar:


Yo, HJ. Long time no talk. How have you been? I hope no one is getting insulting on here today. That hasn't happened in a long time on this blog; just nice peaceful exchanges of information or misinformation, depending on which side is doing the "splainin', I guess. Reminds me of the Rohrschach test; same image different interpretation. You've made some pretty good posts lately.


Doing great! The holidays are one of my favorite times of the year. The GW discussion gets old as it usually boils down to irresistible force meets immovable object, no one wins. Reminds me of playing tic-tac-toe with myself. Thanks for the compliment! How's the weather in your neck of the woods? We're 75 with HIGH humidity. Alot of foggy mornings lately.
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting IKE:
Back to the weather for a flash...forgive me....

12Z GFS @ 48 hours....



Ike - wow, you might have some rain. How unusual.
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Quoting tornadodude:


did we even land on the moon.....? ha jk


All I know is that the night they supposedly landed on the moon, I was there with my telescope and didn't see anybody walking on the moon. And I heard that Universal Studios in California had cancelled all their tours that week!!!!! Wonder what they were filming that they didn't want anyone to see.
Member Since: July 17, 2009 Posts: 71 Comments: 26505
745. IKE
Quoting hurricanejunky:


LOL! Thanks Ike! Good morning to ya!


Good morning....

54.0 degrees and sunny....inland Florida panhandle...brisk winds....
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Quoting Bordonaro:
IF this plays out as forecast DFW, TX could have up to 1 FOOT of snow!!


Actually, if it was dry/fluffy 10 to 1 ratio snow, that would be closer to 18 inches (if I am reading that correctly).
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
Quoting hurricanejunky:


LOL! There are lots of conspiracy theories on that, huh?


yeah Lol how's your weather?
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
Quoting IKE:
Back to the weather for a flash...forgive me....

12Z GFS @ 48 hours....



LOL! Thanks Ike! Good morning to ya!
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Quoting Chucktown:
NWS changing criteria for hail

Link

Here come the global warming comments - bigger hail in the future must mean we're getting more severe storms, etc...

That will lead to a greatly reduced number of severe hail reports, which was the point behind the change.
Severe is supposed to equate to damaging, else, the public ignores the severe T-storm warning after some number of warnings come and go without any damage (at least the hail component, anyway).
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
IF this plays out as forecast DFW, TX could have up to 1 FOOT of snow!!

Member Since: August 25, 2009 Posts: 20 Comments: 6785
Quoting hurricanejunky:


Oh Doug. I thought we were having a good discussion and then you have to go and get all derisive on me.


Yo, HJ. Long time no talk. How have you been? I hope no one is getting insulting on here today. That hasn't happened in a long time on this blog; just nice peaceful exchanges of information or misinformation, depending on which side is doing the "splainin', I guess. Reminds me of the Rohrschach test; same image different interpretation. You've made some pretty good posts lately.
Member Since: July 17, 2009 Posts: 71 Comments: 26505
Quoting tornadodude:


did we even land on the moon.....? ha jk


LOL! There are lots of conspiracy theories on that, huh?
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Quoting atmoaggie:

I am pretty sure Bill Clinton invented the volcano, so no, Gore probably didn't cause this. Unless, maybe, Bill told him how to make them erupt...


oh my... :P
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
735. IKE
Back to the weather for a flash...forgive me....

12Z GFS @ 48 hours....

Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting PensacolaDoug:
I pointed out that a nuclear explosion in the trailer for "An inconvienent truth" could be considered fear-mongering. Regardless of whether or not AGW is real. For that I get crucified! Ok. I get it. Big All is off-limits always. No matter what. Who's ideolog here?


Doug, my friend, I've been following your trail on this topic -- and I promise I'm going to try to do some research on just who did the science research for the film.
But as a former broadcast producer, I was really interested in the list of credits that someone posted for you -- not that I recognzed any of the names except Guggenheim right off the top, and that was from the famous Art Museum...I'm betting there's some relation there.
Believe me, although I've only worked on one movie, and that was just for script changes -- film, video, broadcasting -- is a total group effort, can NEVER be attributed to one person, or one group, come to think of it!
On good days, it works like a well-oiled machine...it's almost spiritual...a coming together of all the right elements at just the right time with all the right techs and talent and producers working at their best, for a solid, well-crafted product.

At worst...it's like a bad day in the House of Representatives or the Climate Change Conference...only with a LOT more swear words and people throwing things! Thank G-d 2-inch videotape is long gone...that stuff was heavy!

Do you know the "auteur" theory? That some films are "authored" by the Director?
Some of us believe that films and broadcast programs are often actually authored by the editor -- they can save or destroy a film, after the director is out of the picture.

Woody Allen sits next to his editor...it's that important to him (I'm not commenting on his final products, here, although I love a some of them, and a few I'm not that impressed with -- as if I could even sweep floors at one of his shoots or sessions.)

And then there's the problem of what shots are available, if you're working on a budget, or have to get your footage for free, like I did.
So you might have to settle for and cut around some slanted stuff, like I did.

We once used some free footage from somewhere, don't remember, and had to cut out a shot of bacon because our product was going to the Middle East and Africa...memory is making me chuckle...

Well, this post doesn't have any science in it...just remember that trailer may have been created by "The Borg" and while it's excellent you question or have a problem with it... don't lose too much more sleep over it.

Best regards, Me
Member Since: August 19, 2008 Posts: 32 Comments: 1918
Quoting Grothar:


Is it possible Al Gore had something to do with this? Maybe someone is placing these volcanoes around the world just to scare us. How do we even know there was an eruption, just because they told us. The Philippines are so far away anyway, why should we be concerned about it?

I am pretty sure Bill Clinton invented the volcano, so no, Gore probably didn't cause this. Unless, maybe, Bill told him how to make them erupt...
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting Grothar:


Is it possible Al Gore had something to do with this? Maybe someone is placing these volcanoes around the world just to scare us. How do we even know there was an eruption, just because they told us. The Philippines are so far away anyway, why should we be concerned about it?


did we even land on the moon.....? ha jk
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
NWS changing criteria for hail

Link

Here come the global warming comments - bigger hail in the future must mean we're getting more severe storms, etc...
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
727. Grothar

LOL!! How are you today?
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Quoting PensacolaDoug:
Oh Doug. I thought we were having a good discussion and then you have to go and get all derisive on me.

Lighten up Junkie! I was laughing while I typed it. Don't read more into it that was intended please. But I do gotta go. BBL


I was laughing too man! It's all good. I'm with you. Have a good one!
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Oh Doug. I thought we were having a good discussion and then you have to go and get all derisive on me.

Lighten up Junkie! I was laughing while I typed it. Don't read more into it that was intended please. But I do gotta go. BBL
Member Since: July 25, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 572
Quoting Tazmanian:
oh cares about GW where this is more fun to talk about




Ash explosions shake restive volcano in eastern Philippines


Manila - Ash explosions shook a restive volcano in the eastern Philippines Wednesday as frightened residents fled their homes, the government said. The Philippine Institute of Volcanology and Seismology said in one of the explosions of Mayon volcano in Albay province, 360 kilometres south-east of Manila, the ashes reached as high as 500 metres above the crater.

The agency said 78 volcanic earthquakes and tremors were recorded overnight and molten lava rolled down continuously from Mayon's crater.

It added that the incandescent lava front has reached at least 800 metres down the slope of the volcano.

"The volcanic earthquakes represent magma ascent towards the crater of the volcano," the agency said in a statement. "If the trend is one of increasing unrest, hazardous volcanic eruption is possible within weeks."

Albay Governor Joey Salceda said more than 22,000 people had been moved to evacuation centres by late Tuesday and thousands more would be evacuated within the next two days.

"I have ordered food to be prepared for the evacuees," he said. "They have to spend Christmas and New Year's Eve in evacuation centres."

Raffy Alejandro, a regional director of the Office of Civil Defence, said the evacuation's target was a total of 47,285 people or 9,946 families from six municipalities around the volcano.

The 2,472-metre volcano has erupted about 50 times since 1616. It last erupted in July 2006, forcing more than 30,000 people to flee their homes.

Mayon's most violent eruption was in 1814 when more than 1,200 people were killed and a town was buried in volcanic mud. An eruption in 1993 killed 79 people.



from here



http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/299546,ash-explosions-shake-restive-volcano-in-eastern-phil ippines.html


Is it possible Al Gore had something to do with this? Maybe someone is placing these volcanoes around the world just to scare us. How do we even know there was an eruption, just because they told us. The Philippines are so far away anyway, why should we be concerned about it?
Member Since: July 17, 2009 Posts: 71 Comments: 26505
Quoting bonovoix:



They just need someone to attack. That is all they have.

Once you try to engage them in a debate and start showing how inept their views are they claim you are attacking them.

"They just need someone to attack", "showing how inept their views are", and "claim you are attacking them" all go together very nicely. LOL.

"I am not going to attack you, moron." would have accomplished the same meaning and saved you a little time.

As for the claims of attack, just maybe it is your vocabulary that brings that out. Just a tip. Your welcome.
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Quoting PensacolaDoug:
unhealthy obsession

So now you're a shrink?
Pardon me. Couldn't resist.


Oh Doug. I thought we were having a good discussion and then you have to go and get all derisive on me.
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
Been fun Be back later.
Member Since: July 25, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 572
Quoting PensacolaDoug:
I dont hate Al. I think his message is suspect tho.


I can respect this point of view because it doesn't have the slant of hatred associated with it. I understand you may be skeptical but the underlying message is to care for our environment. I don't see the problem with it.
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Quoting PensacolaDoug:
I pointed out that a nuclear explosion in the trailer for "An inconvienent truth" could be considered fear-mongering. Regardless of whether or not AGW is real. For that I get crucified! Ok. I get it. Big All is off-limits always. No matter what. Who's ideolog here?


Nobody is saying he's off limits but the Al Gore bashing gets old after a while. We're entitled to an opinion as are you. Why am I an ideologue because I think obsessive hatred and criticism of one person who doesn't really deserve it is wrong? I'm not trying to censor you I'm just pointing out that the behavior seems immature and unfounded.
Member Since: Posts: Comments:
unhealthy obsession

So now you're a shrink?
Pardon me. Couldn't resist.
Member Since: July 25, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 572
oh cares about GW where this is more fun to talk about




Ash explosions shake restive volcano in eastern Philippines


Manila - Ash explosions shook a restive volcano in the eastern Philippines Wednesday as frightened residents fled their homes, the government said. The Philippine Institute of Volcanology and Seismology said in one of the explosions of Mayon volcano in Albay province, 360 kilometres south-east of Manila, the ashes reached as high as 500 metres above the crater.

The agency said 78 volcanic earthquakes and tremors were recorded overnight and molten lava rolled down continuously from Mayon's crater.

It added that the incandescent lava front has reached at least 800 metres down the slope of the volcano.

"The volcanic earthquakes represent magma ascent towards the crater of the volcano," the agency said in a statement. "If the trend is one of increasing unrest, hazardous volcanic eruption is possible within weeks."

Albay Governor Joey Salceda said more than 22,000 people had been moved to evacuation centres by late Tuesday and thousands more would be evacuated within the next two days.

"I have ordered food to be prepared for the evacuees," he said. "They have to spend Christmas and New Year's Eve in evacuation centres."

Raffy Alejandro, a regional director of the Office of Civil Defence, said the evacuation's target was a total of 47,285 people or 9,946 families from six municipalities around the volcano.

The 2,472-metre volcano has erupted about 50 times since 1616. It last erupted in July 2006, forcing more than 30,000 people to flee their homes.

Mayon's most violent eruption was in 1814 when more than 1,200 people were killed and a town was buried in volcanic mud. An eruption in 1993 killed 79 people.



from here



http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/299546,ash-explosions-shake-restive-volcano-in-eastern-phil ippines.html
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I dont hate Al. I think his message is suspect tho.
Member Since: July 25, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 572

Lafayette, Purdue University Airport
Lat: 40.43 Lon: -86.93 Elev: 623
Last Update on Dec 16, 9:54 am EST

NA

15 °F
(-9 °C)
Humidity: 70 %
Wind Speed: Calm
Barometer: 30.57" (1036.5 mb)
Dewpoint: 7 °F (-14 °C)
Visibility: 10.00 mi.
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
I pointed out that a nuclear explosion in the trailer for "An inconvienent truth" could be considered fear-mongering. Regardless of whether or not AGW is real. For that I get crucified! Ok. I get it. Big All is off-limits always. No matter what. Who's ideolog here?
Member Since: July 25, 2006 Posts: 0 Comments: 572
Quoting hurricanejunky:


I think everyone is calm. We're just discussing the unhealthy obsession and hatred some hold for Al Gore. You have to admit it's quite immature and unfounded. What has the guy REALLY done that warrants this much hatred and criticism?


oh I agree, I dont particularly care for the guy. but you never see me bashing him either
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360
Quoting tornadodude:


calm down :P

here is a thought for you:

You said that 98% of the world's scientists believe in man-made GW. What ever happened to the 98% of the scientists who thought the earth was the center of the universe? the 98% who thought the earth was flat?


I think everyone is calm. We're just discussing the unhealthy obsession and hatred some hold for Al Gore. You have to admit it's quite immature and unfounded. What has the guy REALLY done that warrants this much hatred and criticism?
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I'm not trying to argue with you, I am just pointing something out
Member Since: June 28, 2006 Posts: 25 Comments: 8360

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Jeff co-founded the Weather Underground in 1995 while working on his Ph.D. He flew with the NOAA Hurricane Hunters from 1986-1990.

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